<persName ref="prs:douglas_j"><surname>Douglas</surname>, <forename>James</forename></persName> to <persName ref="prs:newcastle"><surname>Pelham-Clinton</surname>, <forename>Henry</forename> <forename>Pelham</forename> <forename>Fiennes</forename></persName> 7 May 1861, CO 305:17, no. 6109, 175. Douglas addressee Newcastle

Published by Jim Hendrickson and the University of Victoria.

Douglas, James to Pelham-Clinton, Henry Pelham Fiennes 7 May 1861, CO 305:17, no. 6109, 175.The Colonial Despatches of Vancouver Island and British Columbia 1846-1871, Edition 2.6, ed. James Hendrickson and the Colonial Despatches project. Victoria, B.C.: University of Victoria. https://bcgenesis.uvic.ca/V61034.html. CO 305:17 CO 305 17 6109 175 34 Ecclesiastical V.I. 1861 received 8 July co_305_17_00177r.jpg Transcribed from microfilm archives, marked up in Waterloo Script, then transformed into TEI P5 XML.

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Despatch to London. Minutes (3), Enclosures (transcribed) (2), Enclosures (untranscribed) (3), Other documents (1).

Douglas forwards Newcastle a letter from Cridge requesting that the government fulfill promises he claims were made to him by the HBC regarding his salary and control of 23 acres of land near the Victoria Church, known as the Church Reserve. Douglas observes that the colony's attorney general, having reviewed Cridge's letter, believes that Cridge has no legal rights as against either the Hudson's Bay Company, or Her Majesty's Government. The minutes show that the Colonial Office concurs.

Douglas, James
Victoria, Vancouver
Pelham-Clinton, Henry Pelham Fiennes Inserted revisionDesc. added, edited, or reviewed abstract
No. 34, Ecclesiastical 6109, CO 305/17, p. 175; received 8 July 7 May 1861

I have the honour to transmit a Memorial to Your Grace from the Reverend Edward Cridge B.A., District Minister of Victoria, praying forthe the fulfilment of the agreement with the Hudson's Bay Company under which he was appointed District Minister of Victoria; and also for the conveyance in trust of a portion of about 23 acres of land near the Victoria Church, known as the Church Reserve.

2. In forwarding these papers, I beg to apprize Your Grace that I have laid the Memorialbefore before the Attorney General, who is of opinion that Mr Cridge has no legal rights as against either the Hudson's Bay Company, or Her Majesty's Government.

3. The Local Legislature in their last Session declined to make any provision to meet Mr Cridge's Salary, and I am unable to see any method whereby such provision can be made from any Funds undermy my controul. I nevertheless forward the memorial, and trust it may be within the power of Her Majesty's Government to administer to the relief of the Memorialist, whose case has excited much sympathy in this Colony.

4. With regard to the conveyance of the Church Reserve, which certainly was intended solely as an endowment for the Victoria Episcopal Church, andwill will in all probability, become, in due course, its possession, I would advise Her Majesty's Government not to move in the question at present; because their interference could not forward the object in view, and would give rise to dissatisfaction whatever course may be taken; and I am of opinion that the decision of the question may be safelyleft left to the local tribunals.

I have the honor to be My Lord Duke, Your Grace's most obedient and humble Servant James Douglas
Mr Elliot Mr Cridge has no claim on H.M. GovtGovernment whatever he may have in equity on the H.B.Co and I am acquainted with no source from which a salary can be provided for him. There is not a single Clergyman of the Church of E., or of any other Church that I know of in Van C. Isld & B. Columbia, Bishop included, who receives emolument from public funds. I apprehend Mr Cridge cannot be made an exception to what seems to be the rule in those Colonies.

See 5176/59 and minutes thereon.

ABd 9 July TFE 10 July
Duke of Newcastle I annex a letter on this subject wh. I have received from the Bishop of Columbia—but I do not see what we can do.

Direct the GovrGovernor to inform Mr Cridge that as it rested entirely with the Legislature of V. Id to renew his engagement with the H.B.Co. wh. had expired, and as they have declined to vote the necessary salary, you regret that it is not in your power to comply with his request—and that with respect to the "Church Reserve", no step can be taken by the GovtGovernment, pending the settlement of the questions at issue between them & the H.B. Co.—with respect to Lands claimed by the Co. at Victoria.

CF 10
This is the only answer that can be given. N 11
Draft reply, Newcastle to Douglas, No. 67, 23 August 1861, acknowledging his despatch and forwarding additional documentation from the HBC regarding control of the Church Reserve. Newcastle recommends that, apart from the cemetery, which must remain open to persons of all religious persuasions, this Church Reserve might be transferred to the Church of England, so long as that transfer does not affect the ongoing dispute between the government and the HBC regarding the company's land claims around Victoria.
Cridge to Douglas, 23 April 1861, requesting that he forward the enclosed memorial to the Secretary of State.
Memorial, Cridge to Newcastle, 23 April 1861, as per despatch (seven pages).
Documents annexed to memorial, relative to Cridge's original appointment and his request for renewal (11 pages), as follows: A. Barclay, Secretary, Hudson's Bay Company, to Cridge, 13 September 1854. Memorandum of Agreement, signed on 12 August 1854 by A. Colvile, Governor, HBC, and on 13 September 1854 by Cridge. Cridge to Douglas, 24 February 1859. H.H. Berens, Governor, HBC, to Lytton, 20 May 1859. Merivale to Berens, 3 June 1859. Douglas to House of Assembly, 10 September 1859. Thomas Fraser, Secretary, HBC, to Cridge, no date. Resolution of the House of Assembly, 20 September 1859. Douglas to House of Assembly, 21 October 1859. Resolution of the House of Assembly, 29 October 1859. William A.G. Young, Acting Colonial Secretary, to Cridge, 8 August 1860. Map of Victoria, 1861, by Surveyor General J.D. Pemberton. Proceedings of the House of Assembly, 20 September 1859 (printed in unnamed Victoria newspaper dated 22 September 1859).
"Church Reserve" Vancouver's Island

The question is concerning certain land surrounding Christ Church Victoria, given to that Church by the Hudson's Bay Co.—but never formally & legally conveyed. At present, a movement is going on in the Colony, to evict the Church of Engd out of this land & to make it a second Public Park there being one such Park already.

2. In consequence of certain pending questions between the H.B.Co & H.M. Government, the former declines to affix its seal to the legal conveyance of this land, lest such a step shdshould prejudice their other claims.

3. Meantime, the inconvenience to the Church is most serious— (1) The Church cannot be consecrated. (2) The Burial ground cannot be consecrated. (3) The Land cannot be let or turned to account.

4. The Bishops residence—built on this land with a view to Ch[rist] Ch[urch] being his Cathedral—is placed under dispute. A Lawsuit has been commenced agst the [Bishop?] with the object of disturbing his possession.

5. The Church is in danger of continual annoyances & persecutions at the hands of men, newly arriving in the Colony, who refuse to acknowledge the Church's prescriptive right of possession to w[hi]ch the old established residents willingly yield. The Colonial Office & the H.B.C. have the power of settling the question, without entangling it with the other subjects in dispute.

7. The C.O. & H.B.CyCompany might combine to take this land devoted to religious purposes & involving the future welfare of the Ch. of E. in the Colony, from the Category of other lands in a similar state of suspense. And it might, at once, be conveyed legally, by their common consent, to Trustees [marginal note: Who?], for the purposes to wch it was originally destined.

8. Should the fact of the Cemetery having hitherto been used by all Denominations of religion in Victoria, be raised into a difficulty, it would be easy to establish the same rule wch prevails at home—to divide the ground into a consecrated & an unconsecrated part.

S[kinner]
Victoria, Vancouver
May 15 1861 My dear Sir,

By this mail the Governor has forwarded a Memorial from the Rev. Ed. Cridge, Minister of Victoria District Church.

I beg earnestly to recommend him as an estimable clergyman, and his case as one of hardship.

He rests his claim on an agreement with the Hudsons Bay CyCompany to the responsibility of which the GovtGovernment succeeded in resuming the Island.

He would consider an equitable adjustment to be the sanction of H.M. GovtGovernment to the payment of such amount as [may not be?] provided by the land surrounding his Church.

This land called the Church Reserve was set apart several years ago to that Church. The legal tenure is retained by the H.B.C. pending their settlement with GovtGovernment. An application has been made to them to withdraw this from the dispute, and allow it to be conveyed to the purposes for which it has been already given.

We trust H.M. GovtGovernment will permit this arrangement & allow the formal appropriation to be made.

At present much inconvenience and injury is caused. Several important measures of our Church organization are obstructed. I am unable to designate the Cathedral Church. Both the Church and Burial ground are unconsecrated. The land cannot be leased. [Illegible] Moreover want of the Legal title threaten to produce difficulties and contention in a country where land is so exciting a subject.

Permit me to thank you for the kind and valuable assistance you have rendered the cause of one Mission by your advocacy at the [Mansion?] House Meeting.

Believe me my dear Sir Very faithfully yours G. Columbia C. Fortescue Esq.