No. 139
18 October 1867
My Lord Duke,
I have had the honor to receive Your Grace's despatch No. 28
of the
24 May stating that the relative positions of
M
Begbie and
M Needhamshould
should be explained by a local enactment.
2. I do not see my way to the carrying out Your Grace's
instructions. If I throw the question open for discussion in the
Council, it will take a purely personal turn.
Victoria will
support
M Needham. The mainland probably
M Begbie. Not
from any certainty as to the superior merits of the former
will
will
M Needham be supported by
Victoria but because he is known to
be more a party man than
M Begbie.
3. Another great difficulty is that
M Needham will not
acknowledge that the Legislature of the Colony has any power over
his Court. He holds that the Order in Council is supreme.
M
Begbie, and I beg to say myself, believe that
M Needham's
Court was abolished
on
on Union.
4. I found an instance of the inconvenience of the present state
of things recently when
M Needham went up to the
Cariboo to hear
the case of the Flume Company against the Canadian Company.
M
Needham heard cases where
M Begbie had determined there was no
appeal.
M Begbie being in
New Westminster, I suggested that
he should take
M Needham's
place
place in
Victoria, but he refused
stating that it would be very unpleasant for him to have to declare
in
M Needham's absence that he was no Judge at all, his Court
having been swept away on the Union of the Colonies. My own belief
is that Your Grace will find yourself compelled to withdraw one
of these Gentlemen. I apprehend a very unpleasant discussion
in
in
the Legislative Council at its next sitting respecting the mode in
which the Judicial arrangements of the Colony are left.
5. The present position of things is this—
M Begbie holds
that the proclamation of Union abolished the Supreme Court of
Vancouver
Island and extended that of
British Columbia over the whole Colony.
He was until
MNeedham
Needham accepted a Commission from me previous
to his departure for
Cariboo, sole Judge of that Court.
6.
M Needham on the other hand holds that the Supreme
Court of
Vancouver Island is untouched by the Act of Union, and is
independent of the Local Legislature. If the Order in Council which
creates the Court of the Island is still in force perhaps Your
Grace
will
will be good enough to inform me if I am in the appointment
of Judges under it to use the Public Seal of
Vancouver Island which
is still in my possession.
7. I have just received a letter from the Police Magistrate
of
Victoria in which he says,
I had an interview with
M Needham today (
16 October) at
which he told me that he did not consider himself to be a Judge
of
BritishColumbia
Columbia but was Chief Justice of
Vancouver Island
and could not act as County Court Judge under the Ordinance of
1867.
Yet
M Needham accepted a Commission from me creating him a Judge
of the Supreme Court of
British Columbia and as such Judge has
reversed some of the decisions of the Gold Comm of
Cariboo.
8. I shall make the
best
best of the present state of things but
I see no satisfactory issue from it save in the removal of one of
the Judges. The case is becoming more embarrassing every day.
I have the honor to be,
My Lord Duke,
Your most obedient
humble Servant
Frederick Seymour
Minutes by CO staff
Sir F. Rogers
In this despatch the difficulties arising from the uncertainty
whether the Court of
V. Island was affected by the Act of Union &
whether it can be affected by Local

Ordinance are restated.
Acknowledge & refer to the despatch of
13 Nov. in which the
Gov
was informed of the opinion of the
Law Officers, & a draft ordinance
was enclosed.
Probably this had better lie by till
M Needham arrives.
Gov Seymour seems to me to have been raising one difficulty after
another & I cannot help believing that if he chose to settle the
difficulty he could do so. I would not therefore be inclined to
give him more help than he has had.
I should be much inclined (if
M Needham refuses Singapore)
to write out that the question [is one]
w presented no real
difficulty whatever and that the
Gov by Legislation were
perfectly competent to extricate themselves from the difficulty
& that H.G. could give them no further advice on the subject. But
I think it m be properly added that if any officer of the
Colony, whether Judge or otherwise refused to conform his conduct to
the Law of the Colony passed in the opinion of HM's advisers by a
competent authority it
w become a question whether the public
interest
w not require that HM should be advised to remove him.
I received reply from
Needham sometime back refusing Singapore.
Approve
Sir F.R minute.
Other documents included in the file
Draft reply,
Buckingham to
Seymour, No. 99,
19 December 1867 stating that
Seymour and the
British Columbia legislature need to solve the question of the authority of
Needham and
Begbie without the aid of the
Colonial Office and suggesting that if an officer of the colony is no longer serving the public interest,
then removing the officer may be in the public interest.